Crossing LOTRO monster play and urban dead for PVP

[Callan S.]

LOTRO=lord of the rings online. Players have their hero, but they can also play as a monster in a special area called the moors. Monster play grants some points to hero play.

I was thinking it'd be kind of cool if you had a big grid map like urban dead, and players have a character, but they can also play out a monster and doing evil deeds would grant their character some sort of destiny points, which would be useful (but not ultra needed, so if you don't want to play a monster ever, it's possible). Characters would start on on side of the map, monsters on the other. Also monster characters could transfuse themselves into other types of monster, eventually even transfusing themselves into a dragon!

There's alot of vibrancy with playing against other players that you don't get with a more static, fixed computer controlled monster. Well, as game designer that's good, because I want to play the games I make and be surprised, and that's pretty hard to do if you know all the enemy behaviours inside and out (and veterans would eventually know them as well as the designer too).

[Jackolantern]

I actually got involved in LOTRO monster play for a while as well. My main gripe about it was that the monsters used the same points to advance as your regular characters did to buy perks. After a few monster levels, you were having to commit huge numbers of the Destiny Points to your monster for even one advancement, and it made you feel like you were wasting the points to spend anything on your regular character. I think it would have felt more rewarding if the monsters had their own point system for advancement, and both monsters and heroes earned Destiny Points separately for PKs.

[Callan S.]

I can't honestly remember how it worked, but I think your totally right - instead of encouraging occasional monster play, that just makes it a 'choose your character or the monster, not both'. I was thinking entirely seperate points as well.

I did a fair bit of monster play on landroval - man, did you ever take part in an all warg raid!? They were insane cool! There would be some freep just standing there then wham, 24 wargs suddenly appear around him and devour him! Frightening as hell! And sometimes a freep and a monster would duel off while the rest of us monsters would hang back and watch - classic moment! PVE just didn't have that but...they weren't going to invest any more in PVP development either.

I'd actually be drawn back to lotro for that except what did they go and decide? Moors are only for paying customers! Maybe they eat up alot of bandwidth, but jeez!

[Jackolantern]

I understand that they had to tip the balance towards regular characters since they have to be near the level cap to PvM (player vs. monster for those not familiar) and any level 1 can start a monster and jump right in, but man...it is just kind of disappointing when 5 monsters team up on one person and still lose. That is what drove me to quit monster play.

Sorry, getting a bit off-topic, but I am still kind of bitter about that

[Callan S.]

I think they had this notion of the hero's cutting down many monster players - without much idea that that'd suck for the monster player who turns up, dies and gets nothing.

I think if monster players got some amount of destiny points for reducing a hero to 75% health or 50%, then that'd make sense - the hero player gets to mow down monsters galore, and the monster player atleast gets some points for having atleast suceeding in making the hero bleed!

[Jackolantern]

I think if monster players got some amount of destiny points for reducing a hero to 75% health or 50%, then that'd make sense - the hero player gets to mow down monsters galore, and the monster player atleast gets some points for having atleast suceeding in making the hero bleed!

Wow, yeah, that would have really helped out. Instead, low level characters are forced to try to creep around while constantly being ganked trying to do daily quests just to get enough Destiny Points to be able to last for 10 seconds before dying instead of 3 seconds

[Rastan]

Black arrow kite ftw

[Callan S.]

Instead, low level characters are forced to try to creep around while constantly being ganked trying to do daily quests just to get enough Destiny Points to be able to last for 10 seconds before dying instead of 3 seconds

Agreed!

Rastan:
Yeah, it was funny how the black arrow became better at rooting than the spider!

It's also funny how in every single mmorpg PVP I've been in, movement speed control is practically more important than what gear you have. Or atleast so I think.